Mastering the Art of Failure with Brett Schultz
On this week’s Level Up! With Shay, I am eager to introduce you to Brett Schultz, comedian, host, and actor. Brett shares his story of coming up as a leader in the Christian church, with his parents being missionaries and how that propelled him into being a performer. He opens up about being a cancer survivor at 12 years old, the importance as an artist of practicing your point of view, the power of adaptability, his urge to put himself out there and fail, why we need to focus on the work more than anything and his experience of coming out as gay within the past year which has opened up the conversation to his social media following of over 600K and to his Christian community.
I hope you enjoy our conversation and if anything that Brett says resonates with you, please share this episode on Instagram and tag me @levelupwithshay and Brett @bretttheastronaut.
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Brett’s Schultz’s links
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/bretttheastronaut
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@bretttheastronaut?
LinkTree: https://linktr.ee/bretttheastronaut
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Timestamps
1:16 - Brett shares about his childhood and what he thought he wanted to do with his life
5:31 - What Brett learned from being a cancer survivor at 12 years old
9:26 - Brett’s journey of moving to New York to study acting and improv
11:14 - The power of adaptability
15:04 - Brett’s video that went viral and how he came up with the idea
18:00 - How to trust your instinct
22:41 - Tips for planting seeds for new ideas and having patience
27:23 - How Brett, as a content creator, deals with refining work in front of a huge audience
“You have to fail in order to find what’s gonna work.”
31:05 - Why you need to focus on the work over the numbers
“My goals are only things I have control over.”
33:26 -The importance of failure
“Failure just gives us insight into ‘oh that didn’t work’”
35:13 - A few times Brett took a leap and has been proud of himself
38:41 - Finding the courage to come out
41:05 - When Brett knew he was first attracted to men and coming out of the closet in 2021
47:42 - How staying in the closet for so many years affected Brett’s life in multiple ways
50:33 - What Brett is doing these days to level up including acting classes and being more vulnerable
53:12 - Advice for artists and creatives who hold back their ideas
Transcription
Shay 0:00
(Intro) Hello and welcome to Level Up! With Shay. I am a comedian and lover of personal growth here to share stories on my level of journey to bring other fascinating and inspirational people to share their story and to help you realize your potential to fulfill your biggest dreams. I am so excited for you to hear today's guest, Brett Schultz. Brett is an Atlanta based comedian, host and actor. He is very active in the Atlanta comedy scene and produces digital shorts that have accumulated over 19 million views by his 600,000 followers on social media. He has hosted at numerous conferences and has performed comedy at dozens more. His theatrical experience includes appearing in Actors Theatre of Louisville's 2019 Humana Festival and on various stages around New York City. In Brett's early life, at 12 years old, he was diagnosed with cancer. Thankfully, after four months of chemotherapy, he was cancer free, and we talk more about this and the unique lessons he learned from that experience. In March of 2020, right before everything started shutting down, Brett found himself living at his parents house and he came up with the sketch idea of "Quarantine". He brought in his mom and dad to act and do camera work for this reality show based sketch. He posted it on TikTok and it blasted off like a rocket. During the first seven weeks it was seen over 17.8 million times and with another 5 million on other platforms. Brett had another big moment a little less than a year ago when he decided to come out as gay to his parents, friends and his Christian community he had grown up with his entire life. He made an official announcement on social media just a few weeks ago to open up the conversation about his experience as not only a gay man, but one that comes from a Christian background. We talk about this more in depth in the podcast as well. Brett views comedy as a way to alleviate tension in pointing out truth and helping people laugh about the hard stuff. This is something I agree with wholeheartedly and comedy has helped me laugh through the hard stuff. I remember first meeting Brett and watching him host and perform improv in Atlanta. It was such a fun and inspiring experience seeing how comfortable he was and how kind he was to other people. I'm so excited for you to hear more about his journey and all of the amazing nuggets of wisdom he shares. So please welcome to Level Up! with Shay, Brett Schultz.
Shay 2:29
Hello, everyone, and welcome to Level Up! with Shay. I have an incredible artist here - Brett Schultz.
Brett Schultz 2:38
Hello. That's very kind.
Shay 2:40
Incredible.
Brett Schultz 2:40
Just incredible.
Shay 2:42
With one word, I get you on my side.
Brett Schultz 2:44
Thank you.
Shay 2:45
And you go by Brett, the astronaut on social media. And I just want to know right off the bat, what is that?
Brett Schultz 2:52
Man, people always ask me and I wish I had some, like super cool reason for it. I was a sophomore in college when I got an Instagram. And I thought what would be a cool Instagram handle. And I just thought @bretttheastronaut, so... I do like the aesthetics of space. I don't really like space in like a 'sciencey' way but I like space in a 'glow stars on your ceiling and your childhood bedroom' kind of way. So that probably subconsciously did something as well. But yeah, it's as simple as that.
Shay 3:24
Okay, cool. I love your avatar. You know, like your cover photo with you in the astronaut helmet flying around his space. It's just so cool.
Brett Schultz 3:34
Thank you.
Shay 3:35
Yeah. So... now that we've got that out of the way,
Brett Schultz 3:41
Now that we've got my instagram handle out of the way,
Shay 3:43
Right out of the gate. So we're gonna go straight to your childhood. So basically, you know, as an artist, I think a lot of artists are like, 'I knew I wanted to do this as a kid'. I knew I wanted to be an actor, singer, musician. Did you know you wanted to be an actor and comedian when you were a kid?
Brett Schultz 4:01
Um, I think subconsciously I've always known that I need to exercise my point of view and vantage point on the world in some way. I think that that's always been, like, I've always had, I think even from a young age, I've had a bit of an eagle eye perspective. I reflect on my childhood and I feel like I realized people were being weird at a very young age when I don't know if other kids around me thought people were being weird. So I've always had this spirit of an artist in me, I think, but no, career wise I acted like all through my childhood. My first play I was in was Goldilocks and the Three Bears in my preschool where I played the big bowl. I was too small though to play the entire big bowl. So I just played half of the big bowl. We held this cardboard bowl onstage. And so I acted through my entire life. I started doing improv comedy in college, but I grew up - we'll probably dig into this a bit - but I grew up in a pastor's home, my dad was a pastor. And I was very serious about my Christianity all throughout my childhood. So I was very set on becoming a youth pastor for my entire life. But it wasn't until I was 25, I was working a full time job as a creative producer at a Christian camp company and I just kind of had something in me that was like, I'm reaching a limit here, there's a ceiling that I am not able to break through, there's certain things I'm not able to explore and talk about. And so I thought, you know what, let's try out this theater thing. I always thought I might be a theater teacher in a public high school. And I also always had the thought, I don't want to be one of those teachers that doesn't know anything about the industry in the world of being an actor. So I was like, let me at least go try it for a couple years and see what happens. But I very quickly caught the bug once I stepped my foot into, back into the acting world. Especially when I started pursuing it as a profession. And all the excitement that came my way with that. So no, it was never in the plans until I was like 25. And then it's probably not until the last like two years that I've really been like, oh, this is like what I am. And this is what I will do with my life.
Shay 6:16
Yeah, I love that. Thank you for sharing. One of the first things you said was to 'exercise your point of view'. That's so interesting to me, because I think so many people don't understand that, including myself, you know, who am I? What is my perspective on this thing that's happening in the world, in my family, in my friend, group, whatever. And to exercise, it's an exercise of using your point of view and finding your point of view. And being okay with, you know, it not resonating with people who are around you, right?
Brett Schultz 6:57
Totally, I was in a spot for a while where I was very focused on following formula. I saw people that went to this improv school, and then they got on a house team, and then they got an agent through that. And then that's how they got their TV show. So that's very much the track I was on. But in the last year and a half, I've really come to understand art as a form of simple self expression. And because of that, to stand out, you really have to be as individualized and specific as possible. Otherwise, people are just receiving an interpretation that they've already seen before. So my main thing in life is to be able to express myself fully and vulnerably. And so I think that that's definitely like bled into my art form as well. And given me the mindset of oh, yeah, I have to exercise who I am, I have to be putting, who is Brett out into the world. And that's the only way that I'm going to build traction and find a specific path as an artist.
Shay 7:58
I love that. And it's going to go so well with what we'll get into later with the questions I have later. But there's one thing I wanted to ask before we kind of move into your adult life. So I while I was researching you, I found that you had colon cancer at 12.
Brett Schultz 8:16
(laughs) What if I was like, Don't bring that up?
Shay 8:18
That's why I asked. (laughs)
Brett Schultz 8:19
It's so funny. Like, I love that you brought it up in that way because so many people will tiptoe around and be like, Oh, are you okay talking about this? And I'm like, listen, I happen to like a different person. I'm someone different than I was when I was 13. But yeah, I love talking about it. Yeah, I'm a cancer survivor. I was diagnosed with Burkitt lymphoma cancer, a tumor the size of a tennis ball in my colon when I was 12 years old. I went through, I think about three to four months of chemotherapy, did all, you know, losing my hair, losing a lot of strength, going to the hospital every week having to deal with all of that. But I went through that for four months, and then came out totally fine on the other end. So super, super, super healthy now been in remission for like, 15 years.
Shay 9:07
Yeah, that's great that it was kind of a quick, quicker process.
Brett Schultz 9:11
Yeah.
Shay 9:12
Was there something that- you probably stood out from other kids, right? Having to go to the hospital or just looking a certain way? Was there something that- I don't want to say a lesson that you learned from that- just something that you remember going through that that you kind of keep with you now?
Brett Schultz 9:32
Yeah, I mean, there's so much I think, you know, I'm probably just thinking of this because I just mentioned it, but as far as building like a point of view. I'm a very analytical person. I love dissecting human behavior. It's why Survivor is my favorite TV show, because it's watching people behave in their rawest form. You knew I'd bring it up. (laughs)
Shay 9:53
(laughs)
Brett Schultz 9:53
But yeah, I really remember a time in middle school, I was in seventh grade when I got diagnosed. Before I got diagnosed, I was never bullied super severely as a kid but I definitely didn't super fit in at my school. I always felt like a little, I don't know why, I think especially growing up as a Christian, there's a bit of training put within me to keep myself a bit of a distance from certain kinds of people. And so I definitely feel like maybe I did some of that to myself, but also kids are just kind of mean, you know, and kids would just throw insults at me here and there. And then when I got cancer, I remember going to the hospital and getting surgery, I was out of school for like a month. When I came back to school on my locker there was all of this artwork and these signs that were like keep smiling Brett, we love you, signed by all my classmates. And kids started being so nice to me. And I just remember very quickly being like, wait a second, you guys were so mean to me a month ago. And it's because I'm going through something hard now that you're finally waking up to, let's maybe be- reach out to this person. But when I look at that, I'm like that has to do with you. That's only coming from a place of, Oh, I'm going to feel guilty if this kid dies and I was mean to him while he was on his way out, you know? So that was something that was a really helpful lesson at a young age. Not even, oh, people are fill in the blank. But the lesson really was, oh, people are really interesting. And it's really fun for me to see how people respond to certain things. And think about how I feel about that. So that experience definitely taught me endurance. It definitely taught me trust. It definitely taught me how to find joy within suffering. But within theme of I feel like what I was talking about it definitely showed me people are really fucking fun to to watch. So...
Shay 11:55
Yeah, I agree. Thank you for sharing that, as well. At what point did you move to New York? And why did you move to New York?
Brett Schultz 12:05
So like I said, I had a full time job, straight out of college. I quit that job because I auditioned for this apprenticeship at a theater, Actors Theatre of Louisville. It was a really great experience where I went for nine months. And it was an acting apprentice at the theater, which meant I did a lot of understudy roles. I did a lot of stage crew. It was really my training as an actor, because I hadn't been in a play in like five years at that point. But it gave me so many connections with other people in the industry, including a lot of people in New York. There's a lot of people from my program that moved to New York, so I moved up there with friends. I had built connections with a lot of casting directors and agents that lived in New York because the apprenticeship at Louisville was a quite reputable program. So it was, I believe it was summer of 2019 that I moved to New York. And it was because that was where my trajectory is an actor was already taking me. But also taking comedy classes at Upright Citizens Brigade in New York was a huge dream of mine. I kind of taught myself improv comedy by watching YouTube videos of UCB online all growing up. So yeah, that's kind of what took me up to New York.
Shay 13:14
Okay, so before Louisville, where were you at?
Brett Schultz 13:18
I was living in Birmingham, Alabama, working at a Christian camp company.
Shay 13:22
And that's where you're from?
Brett Schultz 13:23
No, I'm from all over. I was born in England. My parents moved all over the states. Yeah, my parents were missionaries. So we did a lot of moving around when I was young. But I went to high school in North Carolina so I kind of consider myself a bit of a southern boy with a large dose of city in me.
Shay 13:43
So okay, so you were in Birmingham, then Louisville, then you went to New York in 2019. And that was just part of your trajectory. Did you - you know, you say you're very analytical - did you have the plan, I guess, of going through the improv school and then getting an agent, getting on a show. What was that process like in your head? You know? Because I saw that in LA people having that formula. I even had that formula in my head. What happens when that doesn't work out? What was your whole experience with that?
Brett Schultz 14:17
Yeah, well, and that's what really like- it's so funny because I was so one track minded. When I moved up to New York. Like I said, I had a very clear trajectory for myself to the point where I wasn't even auditioning for improv teams at other theaters, I wasn't even really going to see stuff at other comedy theaters. It was, well, all of my idols have done UCB so that's where I'm going to go. And something really interesting happened in early 2020. I got COVID when I was in Nashville, like March 12. So this is before New York even shut down. And got stuck in Nashville for two weeks because I was the first person I knew that had COVID, I had to find an Airbnb, all the above. While I was there, New York was slowly shutting down. So it was pretty obvious that I wasn't going to go back there. I went and lived with my parents for a few months in North Georgia. While I was there, I started creating internet videos started throwing stuff up on Tik Tok and Instagram, which started building me some traction. I started building a following, and then got an agent here in Atlanta because of that. And that was the moment that I really woke up to, 'Okay, Brett', when I was in Nashville, it was 'Okay, Brett, all of your stages, all of your platforms in New York have been taken away from you, this formula that you thought you were going to follow is no longer even a formula that exists.' And it really forced me into a point where I said, Okay, I have to find those platforms and those avenues by myself. I even had- when I was doing that the whole TikTok thing, I had friends being like, Oh, why are you doing that? You know, it's about the live stuff, the live stuff is gonna come back soon. Why are you trying to figure out the algorithm? Just focus on the art. And it was a lot of those voices coming in and my willingness to say, 'No, I have like a gut feeling that this is the direction I need to be heading.' And when I started seeing the payoff of that, I was like, 'Oh, Brett, you really like came up with this all by yourself.' Not that I built TikTok, but I found adaptability. I had, you know, a bit of a crossroads. And I was like, 'Well, I can either be bummed that this thing isn't working out.' Or I can say, 'Brett, the whole life of an actor is to adapt and figure out what the next move is.' So that really taught me that sometimes following formula isn't even going to be a possibility, so you might as well start working now to figure out how you're going to carve this out for yourself. And the great thing is that when you carve that out for yourself, you find your voice and you find your specificity much more efficiently, because you're being forced to do it all by yourself. So therefore you don't have many voices coming in to teach you what to do. So that was a really helpful and life altering moment for me.
Shay 16:58
Whew! I love that because, yes, when you're at UCB or that improv theater, like you said, that's all you went to, you just went to UCB because you had that formula. Whereas if you didn't have that formula, you would be going out and exploring other theatres, other opportunities as a performer, as an actor, as an artist, and being forced to be creative. I think that has been something that has come out of this pandemic, COVID, whatever you want to call it, as people are being forced to find new ways to be creative. So how did the idea of 'Quarantined' come to you?
Brett Schultz 17:39
Yeah, so this was my first video series on TikTok that got some traction. I did this reality show that was, well, it was like a mapping of Big Brother, almost like a parody of Big Brother, but putting, mapping it with, I'm stuck in my house with my parents, and I literally am not allowed to leave. And that's a situation a lot of people are in. And what are the heightened insane moments that happen while you're quarantining with your parents and can we see that through a reality TV show lens? So the thing that got me to that concept was simply, there were moments with my parents, you know, I was 27, I was 26 at the time. You know, I hadn't been home, lived at home for like, six years at that point. And so there's things that come up, you know, you feel like you're in high school again, when your mom's like, 'Oh, it's 11am. Like, you're just now waking up?' Or even them asking you for help on things, you're like 'Oh I'm so used to being independent and having my own autonomy. I hate that I have to adhere to anyone else' which is so crazy. But it would create these really heightened, stressful moments for me. And when I took a step back, I was like, this is so silly that I'm feeling this way. It's literally only because we're trapped in this bubble together that these very small things are flaring up. So I realized that the other contexts that you see that in, is in reality TV shows. In Survivor, these people are all stuck on an island together and because they're seeing each other every day, and they're having to figure these things out together, and they're put into these very weird, specific scenarios, that's when tensions are going to flare. And it's really fun to watch that. So, yeah, that's kind of where the concept came from.
Shay 19:19
I love that. Taking that feeling of frustration, or annoyance and you have to take a step back. You have to give yourself space from that situation. And yeah, kind of ask, 'Okay, what's funny about this?' Like my family, my family lives in the woods, like in the country, and they're always-
Brett Schultz 19:45
Where are you from again?
Shay 19:46
Illinois. Yeah, Southern Illinois. And we live on 10 acres and so there's just a bunch of animals that will come into the yard, and my parents would always say, 'Look, there's a bird. Look, look, there's a squirrel! Look, there's a deer!' And so I made a video out of that.
Brett Schultz 20:04
Yeah
Shay 20:05
Just kind of making fun of that in a way. So it is fun to take those kind of annoying or frustrating instances and turn them into comedy. That is really pushing creativity, I think.
Brett Schultz 20:16
Yeah, yeah and that's really what I'm talking about when I talk about exercising point of view. It's like, 'Oh, I have a certain feeling about this. How can I express that feeling in a way that other people can understand?' So...
Shay 20:28
So getting into creativity even more, what is the timeline for you between having an idea and making it a reality? And I ask this because you have so many different types of sketches and videos out there, you have like so many different ideas. So sometimes people question, 'Oh, I have this idea, but it doesn't really go with my brand. People really don't know me as 'this' person.' So yeah, what's what's the timeline between having the idea and actually making it? Is it pretty short? Or how do you decide if you're gonna make it or not?
Brett Schultz 21:08
Yeah, I wish I could say, 'Oh, yeah, it's like a two hour process.' It's the same every time. I found my formula. It's really not like that at all. Something that really, I am working through right now is my consistency in creating content. Which is so funny, I had a friend the other day be like, you know, I was kind of talking about that. And he was like, 'Brett, you make so much. You do a lot of work.' And I have to remind myself that sometimes because the tough thing on social media is that you're competing with literally anyone else in the world, who might have the ability to to have more free time or have more money to pay editors, that whole thing. So this is a one man machine. I do have a social media manager, I do have agents that are really helpful. But as far as creating all the content, it's like, it's pretty much a solo job unless I'm doing a sketch that's an improv sketch with another performer. But I'm still directing, I'm still editing coming with concepts, that whole thing.
Shay 22:01
Yeah. And I will say timeline, I don't necessarily mean, from your idea to when you have it edited, I think more of a timeline for me - I'll have an idea and I'll think on it, 'Do I want to make this? Do I not want to make this?' and then it'll be a week later and, you know, I haven't made it or I haven't written something down. So is there a timeline for you? 'Okay, yes, I have this idea.' And then a decision of 'Yes, I'm making this.'
Brett Schultz 22:30
Yeah. And again, it really is different every time. I think what I'm really learning to do right now is to really trust instinct. It's something that's really helped me in my improv is to focus on not living in here [in my head] not planning out what's going to happen, not putting too much structure on myself, but just letting myself, my gut reaction, tell me which direction to go because I'm a very funny person. And so if I just trust my gut to take me, then it will happen. So I've been trying more recently, if I get an idea just to do it as soon as possible.
Shay 23:06
Yeah.
Brett Schultz 23:06
A couple of days ago, I made this very simple video of me talking in my car. It's the day that Spotify went down. And I did this dumb thing where I was like, 'it didn't go down for me, it went up,' and it was too loud and hurting my ears and I'm in a lot of pain now. And that was like, 'Okay, Brett, you have an opportunity today to talk about something that's culturally relevant. If you talk about it tomorrow, it's gonna do nothing. It's not going to be relevant by tomorrow.' That's what makes the internet so tough. And I literally went to my friend's house, and I was hanging out with some of them and I was like, 'Hey, guys, I'm so sorry, but I'm gonna run to my car real quick for like five minutes, go film this video and then come back.' And then I did the editing later on. But I really do try to trust like, okay, as soon as the inspiration comes, let's follow through because something might get in the way eventually. That's why I've been doing a lot of sketches recently too where I just meet up with one or two improvisers and I say, 'Hey, let's, um, let's just find something in the room that we find interesting. And let's just see what happens.' We did this a few weeks ago with Jake and Anna, who you know, we did this sketch where there was cat poop on the floor. And that only came up because we were already hanging out, we saw cat poop on the ground. And I was like, 'Oh, that's good. Let's say yes to that. Let's build off of that.' And because everybody was on board with that, we found something that I thought was really funny. This is different than, you know, I have a short film that I spent like a year and a half writing because that was much more of a journal entry for me and a space for me to process how I'm growing and what I'm going through. So that kind of concept, you know, that was an idea, probably started writing it a month later, but then I would come back to that script one or two times a month over the course of a year and a half, just so that I can, you know, use it as a way to sort through things that I'm going through. So that's why I say it's different for every project. I don't know how astounding of an answer I can give there, but what I've been trying to focus on is just trusting my gut and getting things done as soon as I can.
Shay 25:10
I love that. And yeah, I kind of, I think in my head, I asked that question for more of the sketch, TikTok videos or something like that, because my next question is, how do you plant seeds and have patience for the big ideas? Because with social media you can have that idea and you can post it tomorrow, you can make it and post it tomorrow. But to have patience for a TV show idea, to write a TV show to write the short film that you mentioned, how do you, you know, not just the short form, but the longer form?
Brett Schultz 25:48
I think I would probably answer this by saying, I've really learned to just make work. Just to put work out there. It doesn't matter,you know, 'Oh, does this need- Would this be better as a TV show than a short film?' Or 'Oh, would this be better as a live sketch than a social media sketch?' There's so many limitations we can put on ourselves and a lot of second guessing when we spend too much time saying 'What would be the best way to go about this?' Because I think if you just focus on 'What is the way to go about this?' if you are a talented creative and if you have worked hard and have all these tools in your tool belt, you just need to start and trust that you're going to find something interesting. And that whatever that thing that you come up with is going to find itself organically. So looking at something and being like, "Oh, does this concept work better as this? Does it work better as this?' it doesn't really matter. For me, I just need to start doing the work because through doing the work is how I will find what this thing is supposed to become. So there's definitely times where I'm like, 'Should I put this character on TikTok? Like I feel like it has a lot more flushing out to do.' I've been working on this character, for example, that's like, you know, these like guys on social media that will- (laughs) they'll give you life advice? I guess really, it's like they're a life coach for Instagram. I guess it's a lot of what you do, honestly.
Shay 27:15
(laughs) Let me hear it.
Brett Schultz 27:17
(laughs) Yeah. But the people I'm talking about are the people that I'm like, 'I don't think you know what you're saying. Like you just kind of say all these buzz words.' You're just like, 'Alright, guys today, we're talking about self motivation. So in order to motivate, you need to look within yourself and ask yourself to wake up and connect with what's happening around you. And I'm like, 'You're just spitting off all these words that you've heard people say before.' And with that character, I filmed him like five times. I went through so many iterations of, 'Okay, what if I tried it like this? What if I tried it like this?' and it still has not felt like I've been able to find what I'm trying to explore, so I'm still working towards that. So there are some things like that, where I'm like, 'Brett, if you're trying to grow as an artist, and you know, try new things and explore new things, you do need to take your time, and you do need to allow the natural organic process to take place.' But there's also the times where I'm like, 'hey, if I don't get this up today, I'm never gonna make it. So I just need to go ahead and get it up. And it's not going to be the best work I've ever done.' But that's great because what I want is to be, you know, a year older and look back and say, 'Oh, that thing I made a year from now is nowhere close to what I'm able to do today.' But I'm not going to get there unless I do that work now, you know? So, for me, it's a lot of just get shit done and you're going to get better through that. For me, it's much more about getting better as an artist than it is about getting a viral video or getting lots of comments or making money from a video, that kind of thing. So...
Shay 28:49
Yeah, just expressing yourself is the gift. Because if we rely on other people's likes or comments or views, it just trashes your creativity.
Brett Schultz 29:02
Yeah, yeah. And something I've really experienced is, you know, I start to get a little in my head of like, 'Well, they loved the 'Quarantined' series, maybe I just need to keep doing that.' But for me I got to the point where I was like, this is not relatable for me anymore. Like this is not something that I'm interested in talking about. So I could definitely adhere to my audience, but it wouldn't be a form of self expression. Which is fine if I'm trying to do this as a business, which I guess I am, but it also means 'Hey, Brett, you got to try crazy new stuff. You got to do everything so that you can just get better as an artist so that your work can be more substantial.' Because if I just keep making the same, same, same thing that all - you mentioned, you know, your brand earlier - if I try to narrow into my brand too quickly, I'm not going to ever find the full evolution of what my voice could become. So...
Shay 29:51
Yeah and that was my next question - how do you balance what other people want versus what you want? But also, we've talked about this before - I mean, you just answered that question - but we've talked about this concept before of now people can see creators' journeys.
Brett Schultz 30:08
Yeah, yeah.
Shay 30:10
Right? So we're finding ourselves right now and it's all on social media. And some of the stuff is going to be, quote unquote, bad, you know? It's not completely refined, whereas before, that was all behind closed doors. There weren't cameras around in everybody's hands. So how do you deal with that?
Brett Schultz 30:35
Um, yeah, I mean, that's the fascinating thing about the internet is, I once was an actor that was just on stage and so the only opinions coming through were the people that were in the room, you know? And the hard thing about the internet is that it could be seen by 20 million people or it could be seen by five people, you know? You never know. But it really is so vulnerable because of that, because - this is why a lot of people will tell me like, 'Oh, I want to start doing YouTube or putting, you know, videos up, but I just don't know, if I'm ready. Or I don't know if I have this skill set right now.' And my advice to them is always, 'You are never going to be ready, you're never going to have the skill sets that you need. The only way you're going to become ready and find those skill sets is if you just do the work.' But the hard thing about that is that people are seeing you go through all of this, you know, putting out bad content, trying to figure out what you want to say, trying to figure out exactly how to express yourself. And I think, I don't know how I combat that. I think that I'm a pretty like, I'm just pretty secure in myself, like in general. Like I really feel, especially in the last year, just pretty confident about who I am and what I'm doing and the road that I'm on. So now if the thought ever creeps in of someone having like a judgmental thought regarding something that I didn't also love that I put on the internet, I just step outside of my own story and say, 'Well, Brett, you're a character that is on a trajectory towards growth, and really knowing yourself. So yeah, you put out a bad video today, but putting out that bad video made you better. It's very it's very Einstein with the light bulb. Was that Einstein?
Shay 32:25
Uhh Thomas Jefferson?
Brett Schultz 32:28
No (laughs). That's the president! Thomas Edison...
Shay 32:31
Thomas Edison. There we go. (laughs) Hey we're artists ok? Not historians, ok?
Brett Schultz 32:36
(laughs) That is so funny. God, yeah, I don't know anything about science or history. But, uh, but yeah, it's like, you have to fail in order to find what's gonna work. And if people have a problem with that they can... It's like, 'Okay? You're doing the same thing I'm doing. Like, you're also on a journey. You might be better than me right now. But that doesn't mean that I can't run a little faster and get ahead of you one day.' So for me, the whole comparison game in general is just pretty worthless. And again, I think the way that I combat that is just remembering, 'Brett, you are good because you exist. You are good because you're putting work out into the world. You are funny because you are trying new things. You're really, like, exercising the job of an actor. So I just trust that I'm going to be really, really fucking good one day. And I'm really good now, but I want to be like, amazing. And that's only going to come if I do let people see who I am.
Shay 33:34
And I will just say, social media has given us this reality that numbers are facts.
Brett Schultz 33:45
Yeah
Shay 33:46
And, you know, I mean, I put out a video on TikTok a couple weeks ago, got like, 200 something views in a few hours. I'm like, 'You know what? I'm gonna take it off. I put it back on at 10 o'clock that night, woke up the next morning over 25,000 views.
Brett Schultz 34:05
Crazy (laughs)
Shay 34:06
And it's like, you can't base your worth off of those numbers. And you can't base your success off of those numbers. I mean, what is- you have to define your success, right? There are people who, behind those social media accounts, are happy, which is success, you know? And there are some people who aren't, so it's really hard. There's this screen, right, with social media and it's just become really big in our society.
Brett Schultz 34:38
Yeah
Shay 34:39
Yeah
Brett Schultz 34:39
And that's why I'm always like, 'Just focus on the work' because if I just focus on the numbers, I'm not going to fail. I'm not going to try new things. I'm not going to take risks. I'm not going to get better. So just keep your head down, do the work. The numbers are maybe a little bonus sometimes. What's really tough is I don't need the numbers, but my social media manager does, you know? It's like, we get paid if I am putting out content that gets a lot of views.
Shay 35:05
Yeah.
Brett Schultz 35:05
So that's the really hard part about it, I think as an artist, is one, we really live in a culture that is very merit based and very, like, 'You have to work hard in the way that we all agree is working hard in order to be successful.' And so that's where I'm very removed from that now. And I'm very like, 'No, my goals are only things that I have control over. I'm not going to make a goal of how many followers I'm going to get by the end of the year because that has nothing to do with me. The only goals that I can have are centered around my growth and the work that I'm doing. But a lot of voices come in and it's really hard to shake off those voices. But I think again, for the place I'm at in my journey as an artist. I just have to be getting better right now. That's just what I'm focused on. I am really fucking poor. So like, it would be nice to have money, but we're getting there.
Shay 35:55
That is an artists' life, unfortunately.
Brett Schultz 35:59
I know, I'm realizing.
Shay 36:00
(laughs) So, you mentioned failure a few times and I read online somewhere that you 'crave failure'. That you've said that before...
Brett Schultz 36:10
Did I say that?
Shay 36:10
It was on another podcast, it was, like, on the description said 'In his own words, he craves failure'. So you said it, okay?! (laughs)
Brett Schultz 36:19
(laughs) So yeah, it makes sense.
Shay 36:21
Yeah. What does that mean to you? It's maybe just an expansion of kind of what you've been saying as far as point of view and exercising that and such.
Brett Schultz 36:29
Yeah, it really is what I just mentioned that, like, you're not going to become more individualized regarding your creative voice - and when I say voice, I mean, complete expression of self - you're not going to be able to find what that is if you avoid failure, because you're- failure just gives us an insight to like, oh, that didn't work. And I think that sometimes we feel like, 'Oh, that didn't work and that's bad.' But I don't know where that came from because, again, the Thomas Edison thing, that didn't work, but it got us one step closer to finding out what will work, you know? So that's why I really do- I think that's why it's funny that I said crave, because I'm like, I don't know if I would paint it as crave now, but I definitely accept failure, and I definitely welcome failure, my arms are open to it. Because I know that if I fail, all I'm doing is learning. 'Okay, do more of this, Brett and do less of that.' And that's, that's it. And a lot of it comes from like, other people's perception of us. So I think that's a big part of shaking off the fear of failure thing, too, is like, what are people gonna think? But if I've learned anything, it's people are gonna think all sorts of things. So it really doesn't matter, because you're going to get many different responses anyway. So just do what you think you should do.
Shay 37:48
I love it. Have you taken a leap in your career? Is there something that you feel like you were, like, scared to do? You know, I was talking to my friend the other day, and I was like, 'As an artist or an entrepreneur, you're always on the cusp of things. It's like, you're always standing on a cliff. And you jump because you know that's just how you grow. That's how you learn is that is that failure and taking that risk.' So do you feel that, you know, there are a couple risks in your head that you've taken before that you were really proud of?
Brett Schultz 38:29
Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to think specifically, I feel like a lot of things. I mean, one, just the risk of leaving my full time job to go to this apprenticeship that paid me $500 a month. That was crazy to so many people, you know? But I just wouldn't - if I had, like, avoided that because of my fear, there's so much growth and understanding of myself that I'd be missing out on. So that definitely feels like an example. I also recently had- I was a day player on a TV show that's one of my favorite shows. And it was just a crazy surreal experience. I've been following this art for a while and now I get to be a part of it. And I showed up, I did my wardrobe, you know, I got ready, I went out there, I did my lines, and it felt so normal. Like it just felt really like, 'Oh, I do this all the time.' And I left feeling like 'I truly am a professional now. This really makes me feel like I'm a professional, not just because of the show that I just got to be on, but because I showed up and they gave me some line changes and I delivered and I did, you know, I made people laugh and I did what I was supposed to do as an actor and then I got out of there.' And it just really made me feel like, okay, this is the stuff that is really terrifying. To be on a big set like that and be around talent that you respect and knowing that you don't have as much experience as them. It is such a terrifying thing to step into. But when you can step into that, and then be like, 'Oh, wait, it all went well though. I wasn't like having a panic attack. I wasn't terrified and so nervous to meet everyone. I did a great job.' And I wouldn't have found that I have that ability, unless I'd put myself in that really nerve wracking situation. And now when I am on my next, you know, TV show, cuz it's been a while since that - when I'm on my next one, I'm just going to feel even more comfortable and more confident because I was willing to fail in that first example. So yeah, I feel like I have so many. Improv is a thing to where it's like, improv is just risk, risk risk left and right. It's throwing stuff at your scene partner and sometimes not knowing if they're going to actually listen to you and use it. So even that stuff is like, I might look like an idiot, because I'm going to throw out this gift that no one picks up, but it's making me better to figure out 'Okay, if no one picks this up, how do I then pick up the pieces myself and still make it work and not make myself look like an idiot?' So...
Shay 41:02
Yeah, you're so fun to watch in improv.
Brett Schultz 41:05
Oh, thank you.
Shay 41:05
Yeah, it's just, it seems like you're being goofy and free and smart. Like, I just recognize those things, just doing it so much. It's really fun. So, recently, in the past year or so, right, you came out? First of all, I don't really know - did you know? Did you know that you were gay, younger?
Brett Schultz 41:29
Yeah. So I was, I think I was probably 12 or 13, when I kind of realized I was attracted to men. And then because I was very dedicated to the Christian evangelical interpretation of the Bible as seeing it as all factual and we adhere to everything here. So I believed for my whole life that being gay was really a sin, you know? It's so crazy, I was actually reading some journal entries today from 2011. And just reading how I talk about it then, without- like, I couldn't even name it, you know? I didn't even have the ability to talk about it.
Shay 42:06
Wow
Brett Schultz 42:08
So yeah, that was my whole journey. And then when I went to Louisville, I dated a girl who wasn't a Christian. And that was the first time that I was like, 'Wait a second, like, they always told me that if I dated someone who wasn't a Christian, it'd be really, really bad. And how would that work? And I'm sitting here with this girl. And I'm like, she's like the kindest, like most Jesus like person I've ever met.' And thankfully, we're still great friends to this day. We talked on the phone for like, an hour, like a week ago. But that was my first understanding of like, 'Wait a second, a lot of this stuff that was brought to my attention of the dangers of these things, it's not that. It's very Voldemort. It's very, like, if we don't say the name 'Voldemort' it gives him more power, but when we just talk about Voldemort as if he's a casual person that we can deal with, it's like, 'Oh, it's not that scary, you know?' So I finally started having conversations about my sexuality while I was dating her, actually, and then in New York, a couple- like a year later in New York was where I kissed a guy for the first time. And it just kind of step by step kept being like, 'Okay, all these things that were negative that were promised to me, if I pursue this, that's actually not happening. And if anything, I'm so much mentally healthier now that I can, like I said, fully express myself and have complete vulnerability.' It helps my work so much because before I was very, like, 'Oh, if I'm wearing nail polish in this video, are people gonna interpret that a certain way?' And now that I'm fully out about everything, you know, I'm like, 'Oh, it doesn't like, yeah, I hope they do interpret it that way. Or they shouldn't because I don't pay my nails because I'm gay.' But I'm just not nervous anymore to know what people know about me or what they might think. But yeah, so I can't- I started the coming out process probably about two years ago. And before that, I would tell my Christian friends, 'Oh I struggle with same sex attraction.' But about two years ago, when I finally started being like, 'Maybe this isn't dangerous, maybe it's actually good for me to explore.' And then a week ago is when I, for the first time posted something about it. You know, I've been talking to people that I love about this for a year now. You know, I came out to my parents in like August. So it wasn't that I felt like I needed to go tell everyone, but it was a moment of like, 'Oh, I just want to have conversations about this. And I want to show a lot of people that this might not be what you think it is.' A lot of Christians, not all of them, but some Christians really assume that the homosexuality- homosexual lifestyle means you're doing all of these things. And I'm a person that can come to the forefront be like, 'Hey, I'm gay and I don't go to like, raves' and not that that stuff is bad, but it's like, 'Yeah, I can be different. I can do my thing and still be gay and still be very helpful and all the above.' So, it's been a really cool process.
Shay 44:54
Yeah. Yeah. And that kind of reminds me of when I was younger. My parents found out I was gay, told me I needed to go talk to the pastor at our Baptist church. Went and talked to him. And after- and it was terrible, like, he said, we were going to hell, my girlfriend came with me to the meeting. And then I kept going to church after that. Because my family wouldn't go to church, religiously, you know?
Brett Schultz 45:21
(laughs)
Shay 45:21
They wouldn't go every Sunday.
Brett Schultz 45:24
Right
Shay 45:24
So I would get up and go by myself because I wanted to show them, I can still be gay, and still be a good person.
Brett Schultz 45:32
Yeah. Exactly.
Shay 45:33
And now I don't really follow the Christian way. Just those beliefs. It's probably because I just haven't really explored them and studied the Bible, because I'm sure there are some great lessons in there, of course.
Brett Schultz 45:49
Totally.
Shay 45:49
But I think that was to, like, prove something. And maybe not in a very positive way because I was forcing myself to do something in an uncomfortable environment. But I was still being myself, I was still I wasn't like, 'I'm not gay and I'm still going to church,' I was gay. But with you, you have such a big Christian audience and friends and family, that that is so powerful, to be able to show them the way that you're living.
Brett Schultz 46:20
Yeah and that was my whole purpose in really putting that out there on the internet. 'Hey, like, again, let's just let's just talk about this.' Because I am- I feel like I am an access point for a lot of people to the other side. I've spent a lot of time in an evangelical circle and a secular circle. And because of that, I know that everyone that, you know, speaks out against homosexuality still also can be kind in a lot of ways and loving in a lot of ways so I can show the secular side that side of things. But I'm also very much in a position where I want to show evangelicals 'Hey, I'm actually healthier now that I'm following through with this.' And I've had a lot of trust from Christians. And a lot of Christians have respected me in my circles, because I used to work in ministry. So yeah, so I'm very hopeful that talking about this will allow people to have- just normalize it and people won't be so afraid to talk about this. So...
Shay 47:22
Yeah.
Brett Schultz 47:23
Yeah and I've already gotten messages from people saying, 'Hey, I've been struggling with this' or 'My kid is gay and I haven't really known how to respond and your posts really helped me.' Like, it's really, you know, I had to deal with some tough stuff from posting that, honestly. But the goal was met by opening up the door for conversation with people.
Shay 47:42
Yeah. And it's needed now more than ever, because there are all these laws being passed about not being able to talk about how you're gay or trans or it's ridiculous. But I do want to ask, you know, do you think hiding your sexuality for so long really kept your creativity at a stopping point? Like, how did it affect that?
Brett Schultz 48:09
I don't know how many improv shows you've seen me do - I play a lot of moms. (laughs) I think I really express my femininity when I'm doing improv. Which makes sense because you have no filter and so you're really just expressing your full self. And I have very masculine parts of me and feminine parts of me. And I think that when I was still closeted, and not willing to explore it, I would get very nervous doing improv, because I'd be like, 'Oh, what's gonna happen if they make me a girl? Is that because they think this about me? And then all of a sudden now I'm feeling judged and so now I'm in my head and therefore I don't want to play the princess in this scene, because I don't want to come across like I'm excited to be playing a princess.' And there's just so, I mean you know, there's just so much extra homework that you have to do when you're not able to express that, truthfully. And I always say, you know, like, I'm so excited for people to come out in their own timing, because it took me a long time to be able to do so. And the timing was perfect for when I came out. So I'm not saying that by any means to say like, 'Oh, guys, come on, get out now.' But if art is digging deep within myself, and knowing who I am, and expressing that as fully as possible and there were blocks to me, knowing myself, of course, I'm not going to be able to express myself as fully because I can't even get to know who I am. And that's why such a big theme in my life over the last year and a half has been self knowledge, understanding myself, why do I react to things in a certain way? Why do I become emotional when this kind of thing happens? The more that I know myself, the more that I can express myself freely and in confidence, because I know what's going on with me so as soon as someone throws something judgmental at me, I'm like, 'Well, I know myself. So you may feel that way. But that's why I'm doing what I'm doing.'
Shay 50:00
Yeah, I think that awareness.
Brett Schultz 50:02
Yeah
Shay 50:02
I've been talking about this and thinking about this so much lately of 'Your thoughts aren't right or wrong. It's being aware of your thoughts and your reactions to things.' That's our power.
Brett Schultz 50:15
Yes. Totally.
Shay 50:16
So yeah, thank you. And I totally get- I probably play more men in improv. (laughs)
Brett Schultz 50:22
(laughs) So funny. And the thing is, I think it's a bit of a crutch for me sometimes, because I just, I'll always gonna laugh if I'm playing like, a mean mom. So I really am trying to play less moms these days but sometimes it just happens, you know?
Shay 50:33
Yeah. Well, I have a couple more questions for you. Questions that I ask every guest. So what is something you're doing in your life right now to level up?
Brett Schultz 50:45
For me right now I'm focusing on a lot of practice of vulnerability and honesty. I do Meisner training, which is an acting- it's a form of acting training. And it's all about like, you'll be with your scene partner, and you tell your scene partner, what you're observing in them, whether that's what they're wearing or their facial expressions or just what you think that they think about something. Right now to you, I would say 'You're listening to me really intently.' And you'd be like, 'Yeah, I'm listening to you really intently.' And sometimes because you're just supposed to say what you're seeing, it comes out as not super nice. It comes out as 'Oh, this is a little tough because now I'm gonna hurt this person's feelings and we're not to sort through all this.' But what I found is that restraining yourself from saying the true thing actually does much more damage because your interaction with this person is being thwarted by what's going on in your mind rather than just saying, 'Hey, I'm not telling you it's bad. But you, you do look kind of stupid, you know? or like "You do- you did make a stupid face.' And people might get offended by that, but if I'm able to get that truth out of me, I'm now able to not be in here at all - in my head, I'm pointing to my head - I can be present and connected with the people that I am talking to. So I think just being direct and being honest as quickly as possible is a huge practice for me right now. And it doesn't mean that I- I think with that I'm still growing in how to frame things because sometimes I will be direct and honest and it's like, 'Brett, I'm proud of you for doing that. I'm not proud of you for the timing of it, you know? You could have talked to that person one on one, you could have done it in a more sensitive way.' So that's what I really am working on right now is how to handle the truth with a cushion, I guess I would say. Especially because there's a lot of truth that's coming towards my family right now regarding me being a gay man. And it's just helpful for me to tell people how I feel about what they're saying, you know? Because again it allows me to get out of my head and just fully be there and present with them. And the way I do that is, you know, journaling, debriefing with friends, analyzing, taking alone time - those are really the key ingredients I found to help me find the emotional health in order to exercise that vulnerability.
Shay 53:12
Yeah. Okay, so what advice would you give to someone who holds back on their ideas? Right? Who doesn't think their crazy idea is good enough and they kind of wait to put something out, what advice would you give them?
Brett Schultz 53:27
I think I would start with a nice cozy, 'Hey, you are good for existing. So therefore, whatever you say, is going to be good unless it's harmful to yourself or to someone else. Whatever you do put out there in your work is going to be good, because it came from you. And you're good.' And that's a very easy thing to say and much harder to believe, I think. But I really just believe that wholeheartedly. It's given me a lot of freedom. And like, I don't have to be perfect in everything I do because I'm great and I will continue making funny stuff. If this one didn't hit, that's okay. But what I do see is a lot of people that will be like, kind of like I mentioned before, like, 'Oh, I want to start this or I want to try this, but like, I don't really know if I'm a musician, I don't really know if I'm a guitar player, so, like, why would I be putting myself out there like that?' And what I tell those people is if you're consistent with that and if you continue showing people that you play guitar, they're going to look at you and say 'That person plays guitar,' They're going to start to believe you because you're putting the work out there. When I started putting putting work on social media I think I was very worried about, 'Oh, do people think I'm trying to be some kind of like internet celebrity or Tiktok star?' but that's really letting them dictate what I'm doing. So I think that's a- but what I would say to people is 'Just do it!' because, again, you're not going to ever be ready. You're never going to have the full set of tools in your tool belt. But if you just start working and start exploring, those tools are going to come, people are going to believe you, you're going to start trusting yourself and therefore you will be, you will become- the thing that people need to understand is if you want to become something, you can become that thing. And it's only up to you. Even if someone says, 'Oh, you're not really an actor because you haven't been on this TV show that I know' I'm like, that doesn't change the fact that I am an actor and that is my profession. Because that's the way that I see myself. So, my encouragement to people would be focus on how you see yourself, just start doing the work, because people are gonna love it if you just commit to continue doing it. And if you love doing it that really is all that matters. Because if art is just a form of self expression, that's you getting out all of your truth, you know? So just start now and stop waiting for the right time because the time is never gonna be right.
Shay 55:46
Truth bombs. Just droppin' em.
Brett Schultz 55:47
Truth, truth, truth, truth. Thank you.
Shay 55:50
There was something you said earlier, where you were talking about, you know, 'I am a professional,' I think you had gone to the set, right? And you were a professional. And being on the set doesn't make you a professional. It's doing the work, even if you're on a set or not, it's reading the script, it's going to acting classes, that's what makes you a professional, not this- the consistent work of who you are, who you want to become is what makes you professional, not these, like little landmarks that you hit of being on a TV show or whatever.
Brett Schultz 56:29
Exactly. And that's why I've found myself being so comfortable on that set. And my roommate the day before we were talking, I was like, 'Yeah, I'm pretty nervous for this.' And he was like, 'Well, you do this all the time, you know? Like, you make videos in your room every single day, you memorize lines constantly, you're always in front of a camera performing. Just because this is a TV show that you know and has a big name and, you know, the budgets really big.' You're right, it's the same exact work that you're doing, even when there's a ton of lights and people around. It's the same work as if you're in your room by yourself with just your camera. And that's why I consider my acting class is, that's work. That's part of my job. Like when I go to improv rehearsal, that's a work meeting for me. When I perform, that is a work meeting. And I really, I really have to, when I view it that way it really does help seep into my mind that like 'Yeah, this is what you do for your job. Because this is literally, this is your job. If you're calling it your job.'
Shay 57:26
Yeah, it's that working on internalizing it. Have you seen the Kanye documentary? Have you watched any of that?
Brett Schultz 57:32
I haven't watched it yet. I'm excited to watch it.
Shay 57:34
Yeah
Brett Schultz 57:35
Should I watch it?
Shay 57:36
Definitely. I mean, I haven't seen the third one yet, but he just tells everyone 'I'm a rapper.' And he raps and he makes songs, but really he's a producer. Like he's a working producer and he has to make people believe in him to be a rapper. People just be like, 'You're just a producer.'
Brett Schultz 57:53
Yeah.
Shay 57:53
But he thought of himself as a rapper. And through that whole process was becoming, but he saw himself as that person.
Brett Schultz 58:01
Right, totally. And that's how it is in any career, if someone tells me I'm a doctor, I'm just probably going to believe them. Especially if I keep seeing them being a doctor. So, if you just keep introducing yourself as an actor, people are gonna get behind that.
Shay 58:14
Yeah. I love that. Thank you so much for sharing your story today, Brett. And all of your creative tips and tricks. I don't want to call them tips and tricks, makes them sound cheap. But insight and wisdom.
Brett Schultz 58:31
No, they are. They're all tricks.
Shay 58:33
Yeah. They're all tricks. You have them down. They're your rules. Yeah. So thank you so much for being a part of this.
Brett Schultz 58:38
Yeah. Thank you so much. I love what you're doing. Shay. You know, we've talked about this, but a big, just the the self growth has been such a focus for me. And it really has come through like, again, knowing myself and saying, 'What do I want to work on? What are these hard things are in front of me? Let's tackle those things one at a time.' And so I'm really excited about what you're doing through encouraging people to look within themselves so that they can find that next step because I definitely have found a new phase of enlightenment I think in this year, and that has only come through looking within and saying 'How do I want to level up what am I working towards? So this is so good for so many people, so commend you for for this podcast.'
Shay 59:17
Yeah, thank you. And thank you to all of you who are listening today. If any part of what Brett shared today resonated with you, please share this episode tag me and @bretttheastronaut on Instagram. Are you on Twitter?
Brett Schultz 59:32
No. (laughs)
Shay 59:32
(laughs) Didn't look that up. Ok.
Brett Schultz 59:34
I tried to make a Twitter but the handle was too long. And so I was like I just wont.
Shay 59:38
Okay, just on Instagram.
Brett Schultz 59:40
Yeah, and TikTok.
Shay 59:42
And TikTok, of course, yes. Thank you again for listening to level up Shay and we will see you next week.
Brett Schultz 59:49
Bye, everyone.
Shay 59:50
(Outro) Thank you so much for listening to today's episode. If anything that Brett said today resonated with you please share this episode on Instagram and tag me at @levelupwithshay and tag Brett @bretttheastronaut. All of his social media links are in the show notes so go show him some love and support over there on Instagram and TikTok. Subscribe to Level Up! With Shay wherever you get your podcasts. Again, thank you so much for being here. It's time to level up.
